Unlocking Business Growth With The Power Of Podcasting With Joseph Rockey Of Father And Joe

Business and spirituality may seem like two incongruent areas, but this episode’s guest proves that these co-exist and create not only a bigger but deeper impact on so many lives. Joseph Rockey Jr joins Tracy Hazzard to share how he ties the two, unlocking business growth with the power of podcasting. As the half of the Father and Joe podcast, he talks about the intriguing rapid growth of the religion and spirituality category since the onset of the pandemic. He shares the reasons behind his unique choice of delving into such deeply personal topics rather than the conventional business podcast while also shedding light on the profound connection between spirituality and business success. Joseph also discusses the importance of understanding sales as the anchor for building a successful business and how his business, Elite Business Conversations, assists companies in navigating challenges and regaining control over their business growth and future. What is more, Joseph shares insights into his book, Casino Sales Master, revealing the intriguing correlation between sales and healing the world. This episode promises a deep dive into the intersection of spirituality, business, and the transformative power of podcasting. Don’t miss out!

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Unlocking Business Growth With The Power Of Podcasting With Joseph Rockey Of Father And Joe

I interview cool podcasters who have been doing this for a long time so that you can learn some success tips about how to keep going in your podcast. One of the interesting trends I’ve seen is 1) Since the pandemic started, religion and spirituality category has been growing faster than all the other categories. 2) It has way more episodes than all the other categories. That’s a very logical reason. We have a lot of churches that are running podcasts. They’re recording their sermons depending on the type of religion. It could be a synagogue, a church, or any type of religious service. They could be broadcasting that service, saving it, and sharing it in a podcast.

Some of them are daily. There are large numbers of shows. If you’ve been doing this since the pandemic, three years later, you got over 1,000 episodes, or if you’ve been doing it on your weekly sermon, then maybe it’s only once a week. There are lots of others that are commentaries on religion and spirituality. That’s the host I have for you in this episode. I was glad when he was introduced to me because I wanted to cover this topic area that we haven’t done very much before we do a lot more in the spirituality space but not as much in the religion space. I think this is interesting.

I’ve got Joseph Rockey Jr. for you. He runs and operates Elite Business Conversations, a specialty, coaching, and consulting firm that helps individuals and companies create elite sales cycles, immaculate, and enduring business cultures and secession plans for business owners who are ready to pass the torch. In 2017, Joe cofounded the podcast Father And Joe. It brings people together by exploring the relationships we have with ourselves and others all under the umbrella of the relationship we have with God. He’s the author of the international sales book, Casino Sales Master: Winning Strategies To Beat The Odds In Sales And Life. I’m going to have to ask him about that because that seems incongruous with a spirituality and religious podcast, but we’ll have to find out more.

Casino Sales Master teaches how Joe went into economic sales environments that guaranteed failure and came out a big winner despite having limited monetary resources. The skills taught permeate so much deeper than the realm of sales that they’ll enhance every reader’s life in a badly positive way, and that’s about his podcast. It’s got profound in its thought. His co-host is Father Boniface Hicks. The two of them together have such a wonderful conversational style.

You must read this and understand how to do this type of co-hosted podcast conversation. Doing it in this interesting way may work well for your business, goals, and mission in the world. A podcast definitely has an impact in what they’re doing. I’m excited to bring you Father and Joe, Joseph Rockey Jr, the co-host, along with Father Boniface Hicks. Although father is not here, he’s a little bit busy. We’re going to talk to Joe. Let’s go to my conversation with Joe.

About Father and Joe Podcast Host Joseph Rockey Jr.

The Binge Factor | Joseph Rockey | Business GrowthCurrently, Joe runs and operates Elite Business Conversations. A specialty coaching and consulting firm that helps individuals and companies create elite sales cycles, immaculate and enduring business cultures, and succession plans for business owners who are ready to pass the torch. In 2017 Joe co-founded the podcast Father and Joe. Father and Joe brings us together by exploring the relationships we have with ourselves, the relationships we have with others, all under the umbrella of the relationship we have with God.

Joe is the author of the international best-selling book “Casino Sales Master: Winning Strategies to Beat the Odds in Sales and Life” In Casino Sales Master Joe teaches how he went into economic sales environment that guarantees failure and came out a big winner, despite having extremely limited monetary resources. The skills taught permeate so much deeper than the realm of sales that will enhance every readers life in an unfathomably positive way.

Follow Joseph Rockey Jr. on Social: LinkedIn

Joseph, I am excited to have you here to talk about Father And Joe, but also to talk about your business, the way you work, and why. This is my first question here. Why did you decide not to do a business podcast but to do something deeply personal?

For those that remember, and I know that this was a long time ago, in this country, that transition from Obama to Trump was not awesome to say the least. The country was dividing itself into either you were in this category or that category and you were not allowed to talk to the other team. One of the things growing up through life is I’ve always liked history. Any society, civilization, or whatever you want to call it has dawned this approach of dividing yourself into groups and not being willing to communicate with the other side has always ended one of three ways, either A) There’s a massive genocide, which is a one-sided civil war, B) there’s a civil war, or C) They go to war with someone else. That’s always what happens when you go down this road in totality.

I didn’t like any of those options. My thought process was, “What can I do about this?” That was when I reached out to Father Boniface Hicks, who’s my co-host. At the time, he was in charge of a radio station that was syndicated in a lot of the country. It’s called We Are One Body Radio. I pitched him this idea originally thinking that it would be content for his show. It then had grown into its own podcast overall. This was 2017 when we started.

The original contact I had with him was the Saturday after Thanksgiving of ‘16. I was walking around outside in a snowstorm in Pittsburgh on the phone with him, being cold, and trying to make my thoughts clear to have a conversation with them. What started was I see the potential of a massive problem. I see people getting elected by making this problem worse. I want to do something to try to combat it because I don’t want to live in a world that’s going to end up with America having a civil war or going to a full-fledged armageddon style thing that has been prognosticated for the last many years to the Cold War. I don’t like any of those answers. I wanted to try to do something about it. That’s what I do in essentially every aspect of my life. I take a shot, we’re going to see if it works, and we’re going to go from there.

I’m glad you did. You must have been on to something and you’re thinking because there’s a tipping point that I noticed. This is why I invited you to my show when you came across my desk. I was like, “I have to have him on the show,” because I saw the tipping between true crime is being the highest category of podcasts in the podcasting industry to religion and spirituality as a category. It had grown tremendously.


The Binge Factor | Joseph Rockey | Business Growth


Where I saw it happening was if you look from 2020 to 2023 because of the pandemic. You combine those two things that shifted in our culture, especially in 2016, but even before that, that shift in our culture again here in 2020, you start to see this as more and more of these shows, but what surprised me was the number of episodes that are in the religion and spirituality category. There’s so much to choose from that you could deep dive into. Your show is no exception. As we’re talking, you’ve done 340 episodes. It’s amazing. There are many different topics that you cover in that. How do you decide what you’re going to talk about?

We have had essentially the same ground rules from the beginning. Any thought that I have, we basically are allowed to talk about and he can convert it. Father Boniface Hicks is the expert of experts when it comes to teaching the Christian faith. In terms of the Vatican, which is essentially the disseminator of the information, he’s the number two person in terms of training priests in the English language worldwide. If you speak English, he probably wrote a great part of the text that you are using as far as the backing of what it is.

He looks way too young for that.

Part of walking as much as he does, but he’s incredibly knowledgeable. He has been on tour talking forever. There’s a reason people want to hear him. He knows much. Part of what the appeal from his side of doing this show was he’s a PhD of PhDs. It is how we bring it to regular conversations beyond his practice of what he does in his monastery, which is spiritual guidance for individuals they come in. Part of this was designed to be essentially me willing to be public with my spiritual questions. When Putin started to invade Ukraine, I was torn and conflicted because, on the one hand, I knew this war was happening because Putin was insane. It’s a fact. On the other hand, it’s religion of life. You can’t root for someone to assassinate someone. How do you deal with this crossover?

How do we reconcile that as Christians, the Jewish faith, or whatever it is? How do we do that? It’s difficult. Normally, I save and don’t hit the show early on, but this is what I want to point out to all of you readers out there. This is Father And Joe’s binge factor. The fact that Joe here is being vulnerable and saying, “I’m feeling stressed in the world. This is going on. I don’t know how to reconcile that with my ethics, humanity, and religious beliefs. I don’t know how to do that. Can you help me with that?” It’s on-air counseling, but it’s not just personal because father is putting it in context, giving you a context for where you can draw on what you learn.

I learned that in the Catholic school I went to. I’m like, “I heard that story before.” Now I’m putting it into practice. There’s so much of that combining what’s happening in practice in your world, applying those deep teaching principles that come from Christianity and our faith, and pulling them together. That makes you want to go back and say, “I’m still struggling with this and that. Is there an episode on it?” and they’re sure enough will be because you are 340. I can see that the binge factor to the show is you doing that.

There are a lot of things that we try to accomplish that the themes that go through. Obviously, there’s themes of the content, but one of the practical things that I wanted to make sure that came across with it, and hopefully in each episode you certainly will get it across a series of them, is that this is applicable into your life. This isn’t just a theory that I can do inside my head because if you’re not going to get something out of it, why would you go through it?

Let’s face it. Following the rules of any religion is hard and most of our society is guided towards not doing it. If there’s no payout or benefit, most people will check out at the door. Many of the things that we point out here, people were able to implement in their lives and they get better. It’s because the basis of the show is all about the relationship you have with yourself, the relationship that you share with others, and then all underneath the umbrella of the relationship you have with God. Strengthening any of those three has a magnifier effect on the other two.

It’s one of the great things that people don’t realize. To give a quick analogy here of what I’m talking about, think of your base personality as water. Like any other thing with water, it’s going to go to the lowest point. A lot of people have this false thought, especially with men, “I can compartmentalize. I can be the worst driver in the world. I will cut through traffic. I will blare on my horn and slam my brakes. If I can get an extra 3 inches, I’m going to do it. When I get to work, I make fair but accurate calls when it comes time to disciplining my employees, and then I am the world’s greatest father.” The reality is you’re going to sink to the lowest point. That’s inevitably what happens with all of us. You end up becoming someone your kids don’t want to be around and someone that, “All my employees are looking to work somewhere else, and I can’t figure out why.”

If you lose the line somewhere, it moves everywhere. It is what I always say. It’s like, “If you’re going to move the line in your personal life, that’s a reflection on that. It’s going to bleed over into your professional life.” It happens.

As you grow in a facet, it will bring everything else up. To your point before about the spirituality genre, in general, increasing in the podcasting space, I believe the fundamental reason behind all of that and inevitably with any podcasting, the ones that will survive, are the ones that are based on truth. Many of us looked around, especially during COVID when it started, we saw the rules of how we’re supposed to measure things change sometimes within the same newscast.

With any podcasting, the ones that will survive are the ones that are based on truth. Share on X

If you remember when the thing first started, it’s the most contagious and deadliest thing on the planet and it got here months ago. If that’s a true statement, I would already be dead. That was of my first thought of it whenever we were shutting down March Madness. We saw the rules change and weaken every ten seconds. You can only be lied to long before you desire the truth. That’s an element of people. That’s why this space is growing so much because, at its core, regardless of what religion you’re talking about, your goal is to find truth and, essentially, you’re going to find love in the process. The goal is always to find the truth. That’s why I believe, as a starting point, it’s desirable for an audience because you’re getting the truth.

It’s hard to maintain artifice 340 episodes in. It’s impossible.

That’s the difference between knowing you’re telling the truth and trying to come up with something.

It would be too difficult. You would have quit. It’s too hard. To my point about true crime losing its position, it is a whole lot harder. You have to script and research the whole thing. In religion and spirituality, we can sit and talk. It’s a little bit easier. There is a bunch of fodder out there in society for us to talk about. It’s not also hard to come up with the topic. Maybe how we angle it and what we want to talk about is different, but that’s easier to sustain than something that is completely artificial.

On that note, we do one episode a week. When it comes up for coming into context where we’re going to talk about, I don’t like to make it up as I’m walking in the door.

You thought about it.

I do a YouTube show that I did every day. There were times I figured out when I was on the air, “What are we going to talk about?”

Ideas are getting filed away. I can see it.

There are many times you can call the offensive coordinator horrible and show it on tape without having a new way of saying it. It’s why I stopped doing that show, quite frankly. When we look at it, this is something that when we do Father And Joe, it is well thought out and, at least from me, bringing up the question of intelligence. Father already knows nothing. I have tried to get answers and try to come up with a question that would throw him off. I’ve never done it.

I’ve had a lot of different attempts on how to do things and whatnot. As I bring that up, we’ve been doing this for many years. Not only did the technology that we use greatly improve, but the actual ability to present the content also improved. That’s why I tell people I greatly appreciate anyone who wants to go out and binge it. Episode 95 is where we started the Virtue series. I think that’s when we figured out what we were doing. That would have been a few years as we were recording it. It became a lot better content at that point compared to what we were doing at the beginning. Not to say what we were doing at the beginning was poor or bad. It’s just night and day since then. A lot of people have gotten the most out of the Virtue series itself. I believe that was about seven episodes as it was. It’s around 95 or so. There are still plenty of episodes to get from us after that.

What I think is an interesting model of podcasts to look at and what you’ve built here is that there’s such a rich library, but this is the hard thing about podcasting. The search engine is bad. It makes it difficult if someone like you isn’t sitting there going, “I think you should go back to 95.” It’s hard for us to navigate that. That’s why I think we end up with people who binge listening because they’re like, “I don’t know where the good stuff is. I’m sure it’s in here. I’m getting something right here. I’m going to go back to the beginning and listen to the whole thing. I’ll figure out where the good stuff is. I’m willing to invest my time in that because I’m finding something that’s giving back to me.” On that giveback side, when did you start hearing feedback from your audience? How do you feel when you get that?

Almost immediately, he’s a celebrity in his space. When it came out, there were a lot of other ways to get content for father. That was great. It’s like, “Cool, we have a starting point a little base here.” It grew. He would do in passing bringing it up when he’s doing a keynote address. Next, I’m getting spikes. One of the first places that blew me away that we had a seed in was Tokyo. He did a convention over there and told everyone about it. Right as we were starting, it has taken off. It blew me away when that happened.

Around the world.

It’s one of these things that people want to hear the truth. It’s not a sales gimmick. It’s not this, that, or the other. It’s the way that it is. In my opinion, at least, we talk more about people in the way that it is as people dealing in our reality than we do with the actual Bible or anything like that because we’re always trying to tie it to pragmatic, “What can I do? What is the benefit? What happens if I don’t do this?” and stuff like that. It’s a very pragmatically driven show. That’s because that’s how I am, and that’s why I wanted to make.

Back to this other thought that a head occurred to me as I was listening was like, “Why don’t you have a business podcast?” If this is how you’re doing and your personal impact on the world, what could you be doing in the business impact? I know you have a book coming out, a coaching class, and a business. Why not a podcast for that business?

The reason I don’t have a podcast for the business is I didn’t know this at the time. I didn’t even know I was in competition for this. A guy who owns a satellite syndicated station in Europe primarily reached out to me and said, “I love what you’re doing. I want you to make a TV show for me.”

You’re too busy doing TV to do a podcast.

It’s a once-a-week show coming out in ‘24 and syndicated across his network, which is 55 million households in 43 countries, but in America, the part people care about is this going to be on Amazon. People will be able to get it. That’s called Elite Business Conversations. I named the TV show after the business and that’s what we did there.

That conversation is what you’re doing well on Father And Joe. This is a basis for your business. Talk to us a little bit about this philosophy, but I know it’s deeper than that, this philosophy of conversations, especially in sales.

The starting point of all this is that I thoroughly believe that sales will heal the world without a doubt. All the things I went for before about government making problems worse is tend to what they do because they exploit them because it’s easier to get elected. What solves a problem is, “I have a product that I know will make your life better either by making your life happier, taking away pain, and I want to get it to you. As a result of you buying it for me, I’m going to get it to other people.” It’s a very different sales method than the vast majority of the world uses, which I date the 1960 method.

The Binge Factor | Joseph Rockey | Business Growth
Business Growth: Sales will heal the world without a doubt.


It is pushing in everybody’s face.

You use car salesman. That’s what I’m going against here. That’s why salespeople have one of the churns of any profession. Despite the fact that it is the only profession that doesn’t matter your starting point in this second, your race, gender, age, income level, or intelligence. None of that matters. This is a profession that can make you more dollars, cents, and wealth than anything else.

You can’t make a business if you don’t know how to sell. When we start with that fact, it is the greatest opportunity, but because it’s done wrong, it chews people out. That’s my starting point of the addressing. As far as what our business does at Elite Business Conversations, we help businesses that look around and they start feeling the constriction, pain, and the fear of not knowing where the revenue is going to come from. At Elite Business Conversations, we let business owners see that problem go away.

The next group that we help is those who are in their office and they get the sense that, “No one knows what each other is doing and I don’t know what they’re doing.” It’s like we’re falling into a vortex and going down the stream. We have no control over it. At Elite Business Conversations, not only do we give the control back, we do it in a system that’s going to last well after the fact that we’re gone that is simple enough that everyone will accept, yet detailed enough that you’re not going to be able to make a mistake.

The group that I think I help the most and that I have the most personal happiness with is that group of business owners that heard those first two things and shut down a field of rent in their heart because they don’t want to rebuild the kitchen before they sell the house. They’d rather walk away from their business and call it a day. We say, “You totally deserve to move on to the next stage of your life. Go to Hawaii. Retire. Start a new business and do whatever, but let’s do it in a way that honors all of the sacrifice that you went through to make your business, honors your employees by you going on vacation and they don’t get fired, and then also honors your customers who need what you’re doing here.” Where we help is basically businesses that will last throughout the owner. Whether the owner’s still the owner or not is not relevant. The business will live on and the sacrifices won’t die in vain.

The business will live on and the sacrifices won't die in vain. Share on X

That has so much anchor in your spirituality. I can see the tie in between the two things, integrity and truth. All of those things are still tied into the two things. I can see why someone says, “I listen to your podcast and I am going to hire you.” There is still a business correlation, whether you think of it or not. The one thing that caught my eye when I was doing some research on you is this odd name to your book that seemed like it was incongruous with Father And Joe and with this, “Sales will heal all,” which I love the sales will heal the world. I always think, “Sales cures all.” It is something you hear of more commonly, but I love the heal the world model. I’m excited by that. You decided to name your book Casino Sales Master: Proven System To Beat The Odds In Sales And Life. Tell me about why that title.

The Binge Factor | Joseph Rockey | Business Growth
Casino Sales Master: Winning Strategies to Beat the Odds in Sales and Life

I have been asked many times, “Can you come and do this for me?” This is not bragging or anything like this. I’m expensive. Our business is expensive. It’s a fact of life. I wanted to have the ability to reach out to more people. Casino Sales Master is the best way I can show not only that I did this first-hand and it works, but I did it in the hardest environment that someone can think of.

Everyone reading this knows the house always wins. The casino always wins and the house edge is real. It’s true. How can you use sales skills in an environment that’s supposed to make you guaranteed to fail and come out successfully? That’s what the book is. I do outline literally every step of how to make a successful sale. That’s only about half the book. Maybe it’s only 40% of the book. What a great portion of it is the fact that you need to do this through personal connections and how to strengthen your personal relationships.

That is all Father And Joe. If you want to be successful, it doesn’t matter what your area is life. If you want to be a better surgeon, lawyer, or at sales, you fix this by making better human connections because whatever skill you’re thinking you’re lacking in, when you fix your relationship skills, the rest of it turns off. I don’t just gloss over like, “Have a better attitude.” I get into specific things to do, specific ways to carry yourself, and drills that you can do that will enhance it.

As I was writing the book, I realized a book is great and people will read it, but there’s a much larger audience that want to sit down and watch it. That’s where the coaching class came from. That’s going to be strictly video that at Casino Sales Master, you’ll be able to see the different options that you have. Every section of the sale that we cover in the book, we do a dedicated video to that you can go through and say, “I want to get better training on this. I want to implement what Joe’s teaching into my company. Here’s a video on how to have the appropriate mindset. Here’s a video on how to have my prospects never want to lie to me again and have it work. How can I figure out what my prospects is and what my ideal prospect should be?”

I bring this one potentially because it’s the best contrast to the 19 Sales Method Versus Reality. When historically people were taught, “How do I figure out what my ideal prospect is?” they come up with a list of demographics. They’re going to be between this age, gender, race or whatever this part of the country. Not a single part of that is true. None of that is relevant.

What’s relevant is what problem they need solved that you can do, and that’s it. Once you do that mindset shift, “I don’t care what they are in terms of the way they look, smell, taste, or whatever,” what I care is, “I’m a car company. This guy needs to be able to haul a boat and my truck into it. I don’t care what he looks like. I care that I can solve his problem.” That’s a completely different mindset shift versus the way that MBAs are still taught to people now in defining their ideal prospect. It goes back to the starting point of this conversation. People want the truth. This is why, quite frankly, I’m too expensive to be able to give information one-on-one and why I had to make this book.

I think it’s this. You can’t have a relationship with others when you don’t have a relationship with yourself. That’s what I’ve discovered long and hard. My best staff and partners in business all come from someone who feels much more comfortable in their own skin. That makes a huge difference. I can work with that. When they’re still trying to figure that out, it’s so much harder. That’s where I think Father And Joe ties into that because if we’re not sitting back and reflecting, then we are never going to become comfortable with ourselves.

We have addressed that notion a lot. It is easy and common to live in autopilot. Our brains are programmed to do that for us. When was the last time you thought about breathing and how the back of your back feels? I don’t know what I it was called, but I describe an example here. When you sit down and think about your processes, which we do a lot and it’s a lot of what the show is in a way, “What am I doing? Why am I doing it? How do I explore myself?” and look at our situation through adult eyes, “If I think about this, I’m reacting this way because when I was six, this is how I was supposed to react. Now that I’m adult, I shouldn’t. How should I do this as an adult,” sit back, and think about things about the way that we are and the way that we conduct ourselves, it changes everything. It’s one of those things that you don’t need to do a lot. You just need to do it right. When you do it right, it makes a massive difference. This is how long we’ve been doing it. Defragging your computer doesn’t exist in modern technology.

That’s old school. I don’t know that my kids have ever defragged anything, but I could say I have.

That’s what we’re trying to do with our minds and our relationships like, “This is wrong. Let’s rebuild it correctly through an adult perspective.”

Get rid of some of that clutter and noise and make a straighter path. Live a life of intention, which is whether you believe in God or not, living a life of intention is, “Why are we here if not to do that?” That’s important. It does have a direct relationship to whether or not you can tell. The number one thing that I’ve seen over the years in my businesses that someone who doesn’t believe in what they sell or believe that they can sell will never sell. Fundamentally, it’s not going to happen.

There are lots of ways to solve that problem, but that’s a fundamental fact. If you don’t believe in yourself and your product, you shouldn’t be selling it. If you don’t believe in your product, you should not be selling that product even if you could because there are great salespeople that move whatever because, “I can make a commission on it so I’ll sell it.” That’s not going to help anyone in the long run. Eventually, people come to that conclusion themselves.

The simple fact is we’re all capable of doing it. We all have the basic requirements, essentially from birth. We know how to communicate with people. We know how to connect with people. The problem is many of us throughout our journeys of life have had these skills trampled on or discouraged and we never truly develop them successfully or the way that we would want them if we looked at ourselves objectively now like, “I don’t want to be shy where I have to hide. I’d rather go out and talk to people. I wish I had the ability to tell people know sometimes and set boundaries.”

These are all things that get developed in us from a child, but how do we figure out how to use them in life because they make better adults once you figure this out and obviously much better at sales and everything? These are topics that we have discussed on the show in various formats about how to address this with ourselves address, the pains, and uncomforts of our youth and how to move forward.

It’s important that you’re having those conversations examining that for yourself. That helps your audience do the same thing. That’s critical in the scope of things. You got the book, coaching course, and a TV show. You got a lot going on. How are you going to keep fitting in Father And Joe? Is there going to be shifts in how things are going to work? What’s the future for that?

Father And Joe is the bedrock of what we did. That’s never getting taken out or under any circumstances. Both of us are full-on committed to it. It’s one of the few things in my life I don’t get paid for at all. I don’t even promote any of the other stuff on there at all. I do one episode when I was going to release the book because I did have to address the incongruence that you brought up in the show and have a book called Casino Sales Master.

I don’t advertise my other stuff on it. In part, because I know I’m helping people. I don’t need to be selling on it. The other reason I love doing this is because I know it’s making a difference. At the end of the day, it wouldn’t be growing month over month if people weren’t getting out of it. You would get what normally happens, “I watched this show for about ten minutes. I gave it a chance for a second episode, and then I took it off my watch list,” because that’s what people are. That’s what we do. We’ve all done that on Netflix or whatever channel you’re watching on. The fact that people keep coming back and back to me is proof that we’re making a difference to people. Not all of them will send us emails and tell us what to talk about.

Do they suggest topics or do they ask you to talk about things?

Occasionally, we get them. It’s certainly not the norm. Occasionally, it does happen. We bring it up as much as we can. What I get a lot of in response was, “Joe, that was something I always wondered about. Thank you for figuring out how to say what I meant.” One of our most popular episodes we nailed on the head was, “Intellectually, I can grasp the concept of God, but I don’t feel it. Is there something wrong with me because of that?” As a result, that has become one of our most popular episodes.

Everyone has that thought. I went to Catholic school, but I’m a lapsed Catholic. That is exactly the thought that goes through your mind over the years. You are like, “Do I find a new church in this new area or not? Am I feeling God?” is what you’re asking. You don’t realize you are.

Being the fact that it’s a Catholic show, “Should I feel guilty because I’m not thinking the way that this person told me when I was four?”

Catholic guilt is heavy.

We address that. One of the things that ease people into conversation is think of any other relationship you have in your life. When it is done correctly, both parties get something out of it. That’s never viewed as a bad thing. Your relationship with God is the same way. You don’t want to be the same guy who only ask for money and never gives anything in return because we never like those people in our lives, but those that we have good relationships with, both people get something out of it. That’s the part of this that many people miss when we start thinking about guilt like, “I’m not allowed to get extra bonus good things in my life because I’m practicing the religion of love.”

In any other relationship you have in your life, when it is done correctly, both parties get something out of it. Your relationship with God is the same way. Share on X

You are. In fact, you’re supposed to. This is called the fruits of the victory. Do it. Now you become easier to talk to. People want to talk to you and become more confident. Confidence is one of the few universal things every person who’s playing it finds attractive. It goes from there. Literally, I direct the people to start with the virtue series. This is where a lot of them come from, and the benefits you can get how to practice them in your life.

I am glad that you and Father Boniface brought this to the world. I’m glad you’re committed to continuing to have this impact in the world because, as you put it, sales are going to heal the world before conversations. By this podcast, you’re not only bringing the conversation out like doing it, but you’re also bringing it so that I’m going to go home and talk about it. Now, that’s impacting and changing my family and my personal revelations as well. The impact is deep-seated. Thank you for doing that.

To give people clear expectations, it’s not overnight. I give people this example. If you have never run before, you’re not going to wake up and run a four 340 and beat the same pole. You’re going to get there gradually and keep working on it. The joy of this, unlike things that require your body, is you can get to perfection and to whatever the equivalent of the olympic record is by working on it. Some of us will do it at different paces. Some speed bursts here and there, but the point is putting in the effort, thoughtfulness, and purpose into our thoughts, which is what makes a difference there. I definitely thank you for having me on the program here. Is it okay to ask you a question?


What stood out to you that you like from this episode?

You’re very different than a lot of the other people that I get to interview. They have a very straightforward business purpose for starting this show and your purpose was much more transformational over time that it was to have the conversation see what came. That has a different ruling model to it. That’s an a-ha to me. This is a different model for podcasting. This could work for other people. I can help them grow their shows by making them aware that this exists as an idea and in execution because you’ve been doing it for 340 episodes. What I’m always looking for in my episode here is like, “How can I get to something that someone else could apply to what they’re looking to do in the world?” That’s my whole role here and the impact that I want to have. This is something new that hasn’t been brought out before.

I appreciate that. That’s what we’re trying to do here. One thing in it that makes it easy is I know I’m never lying. You know how you’re in a conversation and somehow you think you know what you’re talking about, but you should getting out on a limb, “I’m going to keep going that way.”

I’ve heard people like that.

You can tell we’re talking to someone when they are there.

They’re going down that rabbit hole.

Those shows never lie because, at the end of the day, there are many things that the audience can tell. There’s insincerity. The hosts can feel that they’re doing it. I would say this to anyone out there who is doing a show and wants to have a grow. You need to know what your system is. What are you talking about that can go from broad? We talk about God all the way down to thirteen steps deeper, we talk about how specifically when you have this thought from your childhood that makes you feel guilty. Does that make you a better person, how to deal with it, and what to do about it next?

If you have a system that can go through every single step without missing a step that anyone, whether they’re agnostic, Buddhist or whatever, could go through and go, “This makes sense. I can see how it’s beneficial.” That works. It doesn’t matter where your topic is because I have the exact same thing for the sales method I teach and on the culture method that I teach for businesses. The point is when you know that you have tremendous strength, know what you’re talking about, and never lie because the number one turn-off is lying.

The number one turn-off is lying. Share on X

That’s where we’re at more than anything. We’re in a space where people’s radar are so much higher and more tuned than it’s ever been in any generation ever. “Am I talking to a person? Am I talking to someone who knows what they’re talking about? Am I talking to someone who cares?” AI can never do that. More of our lives are surrounded by AI talking to us. We’re inherently building up fences of, “Am I dealing with a real person or not? Should I be dealing with this person?” The more fake, insincere, or insecure you are, the more you become noise that comes almost indifferential from AI. It’s a fact of life.

That’s what I love about podcasting and especially love about your show, that human connection or that human conversation. The more we elevate that, the more we’re bringing great impact into the world. Thank you for bringing Father And Joe to the world and for bringing your business and those same business principles tying them together. I appreciate you.

Thank you for having me and having the opportunity to talk about Father And Joe. I appreciate it a lot.

As I’m listening to Father And Joe, I’m thinking about Socrates’ message, “The unexamined life is not worth living.” At the same time, I’m going through a transformational program with a group that I belong to with the most important conversations, which is called Whole Life Architecture. It’s about deeply seating intention in every part of your life. We stop consuming things without thinking about the intention and the purpose of that. The two things are tied together. Whether or not you’re seeking out religious enlightenment, personal enlightenment, or whatever it is that you’re doing, there’s a podcast out there for you. People have been devoting time and energy to creating that for you.

Three hundred and forty episodes later, there’s not a topic, area, or thought that they might not have covered already in this scope of things, and they’re not done. Something else is coming up next. They’re going to raise that. They’re going to talk about that. I invited Joe to think about an engagement strategy where he asks for input. He has difficulties with scheduling because it is.

When you have someone who’s busy and famous like Father Boniface, then you have to be cognizant of their schedule and how can you fit that in, but maybe there’s a way for you to submit audio questions from your audience or something where you can get outside perspectives and you can bring in and broaden it over time and not just have it all be about all of the two of you. That could be a way. There are ideas for if you want to start here, broaden, narrow back down, and do a series. There are all kinds of ideas and ways that you could do that.

Here’s what I know. This is why I wanted to bring Joe on. He clearly has a business. His podcast is helping him close business. It is helping him in his business because who you are in one thing is who you are everywhere. When he’s honest, truthful, and introspective, he’s going to make a better coach. He’s going to be a better consultant for your company. He’s going to be a more honest sales builder for you. Those things do go hand in hand, but also remember the flip side of that is that if you’re creating artifice out there, it’s not going to serve your business.

That honesty, integrity, and trust that you’re building has to go through and be a continuous life for you, not just in your personal if you’re going to do a real personal show but also in the business that you develop from it. The two things go hand in hand. Joe Rockey is like that. He is exactly who he said. One of the things he offered me as soon as we hung up was, “How can I serve you? How can I make some more referrals for you? How can we make time to make sure we do that?” That is a person who’s in the world to do service.

I might be able to use his services, but it’s not going to come because he pushed it on me or sold me. It’s going to become because I enjoyed my conversation, relationship, and who he is deep inside. That’s what you want to build from your show. Use podcasting to its best advantage. This is a conversation, not just with who you’re talking to on the show. It’s a conversation with your audience. It happens to be one-sided because you don’t hear what they have to say, but guarantee they are talking back to you.

They’re talking back in their mind. They’re thinking through how they can connect with you. They are thinking through those things. If you’re not open and inviting that, in concept, they’re going to feel that you’re talking to them. Think about it as this conversation the whole way around it, that intentional conversation is going to do you so well.

If you’ve been tossing around, “Do I do a business or personal podcast?” this is a great opportunity to look at a model that works. Think about that. Joe never once sells anything. He once mentioned his book on the show, but he doesn’t sell anything, but it does serve his business because it shows the world who he is, what his purpose and intention in the world is, and the fact that he can stay committed to something, 340 episodes in.

Take a listen to Father And Joe. Go check out Joe Rockey and get on the list for his new book when it comes out. Think about making this year, the year of being intentional and purposeful with your podcast. Thanks for reading. I’ll be back here with another guest and another perspective on podcasting that you might not have read before.


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Tracy Hazzard

Tracy Hazzard is a former Authority Magazine and Inc. Magazine Columnist on disruptive innovation, and host of 5 top-ranked podcasts including: The Binge Factor and Feed Your Brand–one of CIO’s Top 26 Entrepreneur Podcasts. She is the co-founder of Podetize, the largest podcast post-production company in the U.S. As a content, product, and influence strategist for networks, corporations, marketing agencies, entrepreneurs, publications, speakers, authors & experts, Tracy influences and casts branded content with $2 Billion worth of innovation around the world. Her marketing methods and AI-integrated platform, provides businesses of all sizes a system to spread their authentic voices from video to podcast to blog, growing an engaged audience and growing valuable digital authority.
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